Best post Berry REM tracks

[chogdog]

I went back and listened to Reveal a few times. I still can't get into the song "Chorus and the Ring". Some of the songs are better than I remember though. The production on this album kills me. Too much orchestration over strummed acoustic guitars over electronic drums and bleeps and blips. I think the electronics on Up worked because it was more sparse. The worst part though is the distorted lower registers synths or whatever they are that seem to come and then just abruptly disappear on alot of the tracks. I think these later albums all had some good songs. I think they suffered primarily from diminished quality songwriting. Around Green Peter Buck pretty much abandoned guitar. When he tried to come back to guitar on Monster I think he has lost something. Instead the great Byrdsian arpeggios and Gang of Funk angular post punk riffs of old, he returned with bludgeoning distorted open string Chords. He never seemed to recover his older guitar brilliance. Maybe it was intentional, maybe he just lost it. His Beach Boys obsession also did not help. Another major factor in their downfall was Michael Stipes increasing talk singing. It was kind of okay when he started doing it on songs like "ebow the letter" but when he started talk singing every ballad, things really went down hill. I think that is why "We all go back .." is so great as he actually is singing a ballad for once. The fact his lyrics were getting progressively worse was also a factor. The production as Boxcar mentioned did not help. I think they tried to go more rock for the last two albums but instead of returning to great IRS sounds they went pretty much back to the Monster sound. Again not saying there aren't great stuff on these last albums. There is a lot of great stuff just not really too many great albums.

[Doug]

Gang of Funk!

Well said, Dog! My thoughts exactly.

Here's my top 15, post-Berry, in chronological order:

At My Most Beautiful
I'm Not Over You
Daysleeper
Walk Unafraid
Hope
Sad Professor
The Great Beyond
Bad Day
The Lifting
Living Well...
Man-Sized Wreath
Horse to Water
Staring Down the Barrel at the Middle Distance
Discoverer
Mine Smell Like Honey (great tune, god-awful lyrics and title)

[Beldo]

I'm the only fan of "I've Been High" I guess. I'm a sucker for a synth ballad.

[chogdog]

I'm the only fan of "I've Been High" I guess. I'm a sucker for a synth ballad.

That is one of the songs that was a lot better than I remember it. I would add the Lifting, Beat a Drum, and She just Wants to Be to that list.

I think Summer Turns to high had a potential to be a great Beach Boys tribute (it's definitely inspired by the Beach Boys Smile "Cabinessense," "Wonderful," and "Windchimes" and sort of like a sequel to "at my most beautiful") but those backwards high-hats (ala Strawberry fields) or whatever they are that just come and disappear ruin the song. Also if you are going to do such a blatant beach boys rip off. Do it right. You keep expecting to hear some great back up vocals but they never come. This song could have benefitted from Mike Mills doing some great upper register backup singing. ,

[Sandusky]

Around Green Peter Buck pretty much abandoned guitar. When he tried to come back to guitar on Monster I think he has lost something. Instead the great Byrdsian arpeggios and Gang of Funk angular post punk riffs of old, he returned with bludgeoning distorted open string Chords. He never seemed to recover his older guitar brilliance. Maybe it was intentional, maybe he just lost it.

Well said, something I've always thought too. It's like he started to hate the guitar and lost total interest in it. First he became obsessed with the mandolin, then he started fucking around with moogs and not even playing guitar. Weird, after grunge hit he started playing like those guys. No jangle. Although I don't totally agree with you on how bad Reveal is, you make valid points. I've never been a big Brian Wilson fan either, but I don't all out hate a lot REM's tribute songs. Mike Mills and Stipe do great harmonies. It's a late night, late August druggy, dreamy kind of album. It might be my favorite post Berry.

[Hap]

I'm the only fan of "I've Been High" I guess. I'm a sucker for a synth ballad.

No, no, this is a great song. That said, it's funny that every decade or so REM writes a song that is just perfect for people to put on repeat when they're drunk and depressed. This was my old neighbor's go-to. For a 3-month period after he had a breakup, I could guarantee hearing this one through the walls at 3am on Saturdays.

Myself, I'm a shade more sophisticated as to my pityparties, so I travel Across the Pond for Morrissey's soothing brand of "poor me."

[Boxcar Trev]

Chog wrote:

When he tried to come back to guitar on Monster I think he has lost something. Instead the great Byrdsian arpeggios and Gang of Funk angular post punk riffs of old, he returned with bludgeoning distorted open string Chords. He never seemed to recover his older guitar brilliance. Maybe it was intentional, maybe he just lost it.

I'm not sure about this. Unlike other bands that had been around a long time eg U2, they were adamant that they werent going to go back to their early sound and repeat themselves. While we were all craving for a Fables vol 2, they tried to go down a new path with mixed success ( big in Europe, less so in the States) The only exception that I can recall was Imitation Of Life where Buck admitted it was a rewrite of Driver 8 ( or something similar ) but his guitar was drowned in strings and they stuck in that horrible synth solo ( subsequently dumped when they played it live ). If you listen to the Live At the Olmympia album which acted as the prep for Accelerate, Buck has no problem playing all those old Byrdsian arpeggios. I think being a slave to the 'got to do something new' philosophy was a big part of their slide which they stuck with until their final album, Collapse Into Now which was their greatest hits, rewritten. Having said all that, I totally agree with you that there's some great songs on every album.

[chogdog]

Chog wrote:

When he tried to come back to guitar on Monster I think he has lost something. Instead the great Byrdsian arpeggios and Gang of Funk angular post punk riffs of old, he returned with bludgeoning distorted open string Chords. He never seemed to recover his older guitar brilliance. Maybe it was intentional, maybe he just lost it.

I'm not sure about this. Unlike other bands that had been around a long time eg U2, they were adamant that they werent going to go back to their early sound and repeat themselves. While we were all craving for a Fables vol 2, they tried to go down a new path with mixed success ( big in Europe, less so in the States) The only exception that I can recall was Imitation Of Life where Buck admitted it was a rewrite of Driver 8 ( or something similar ) but his guitar was drowned in strings and they stuck in that horrible synth solo ( subsequently dumped when they played it live ). If you listen to the Live At the Olmympia album which acted as the prep for Accelerate, Buck has no problem playing all those old Byrdsian arpeggios. I think being a slave to the 'got to do something new' philosophy was a big part of their slide which they stuck with until their final album, Collapse Into Now which was their greatest hits, rewritten. Having said all that, I totally agree with you that there's some great songs on every album.

I was referring more to his songwriting and riff production than his technical ability to play the stuff. Take a listen to a song like "Wolves, Lower" and then to any song off the last two albums and there's no comparison. One is inventive and brilliant and the later may sound okay but is mostly just bashing out chords. I don't think I was asking for a return to an exact replica of the earlier sound which actually was quite varied: Chronic Town doesn't really sound like Murmur which doesn't sound like Reckoning which doesn't sound like Fables etc up to Document. But those albums all had great guitar riffs. It seems to me they moved most to the sound of Monster which maybe when Peter Buck picks up a guitar to write something new that is all that can comes out.

[Boxcar Trev]

I agree the instrumental side of the songwriting became far less inventive during this period. I still cant help wondering though if part of that wasnt down to their reluctance to go back to back to the basics of guitar, bass and drums on the run from Up to Around The Sun. With the final two albums, both lyrically and musically they were on autopilot and I agree something like Supernatural Superserious would have sat neatly on Monster. Lets face it, those first half a dozen albums are so good that they were never going to get near that inventiveness later in their career. I'm just glad they made so much great enduring music.

[Sandusky]

Yeah, really. Who else can say that their first 7 albums are all classics? Nothing in American rock touches those IRS REM albums.

[lovesick blues]

Yeah, really. Who else can say that their first 7 albums are all classics? Nothing in American rock touches those IRS REM albums.

Eight-I would say 'Automatic for the People' is their greatest album.

[Beldo]

The only real misstep with Berry was Monster, IMO. I think New Adventures in Hi-Fi is up there with their IRS work.

[chogdog]

I think we've had this discussion before but I'm not a fan of Automatic for the People. In my opinion it's not even in their top eight albums. Apart from their first 5, which in my opinion are untouchable, I would rank Green, Up and New Adventures in Hi-Fi as better. New Adventures is a decent album but itself is sort of over-rated as it's Berry last album album. Out of Time for me is terrible. That album drove me away from buying a new REM album for over 10 years.

[Boxcar Trev]

Really ? Its a funny old world because I really liked Out Of Time with only Radio Song seeming out of place to me. We even loved Shiny Happy People in our house Green on the other hand was the first album for me that wasnt great from start to finish. I've never really got on with Stand, Pop Song 89 or Orange Crush.

[Beldo]

Out of Time is more hit or miss than their IRS work, but the hits are some of their best tracks ever.